Paul Mulshine says that Natalie Maines was in over her cultural head, and doesn't understand her fan base at all.

The only thing that would astound the typical country fan about Maines' encounter with anti- Americanism is the fact that she didn't slug the person expressing it. Another singer from country's classic era, Merle Haggard, put it this way: "When you're runnin' down my country, man, you're walkin' on the fightin' side of me."

Without knowing it, Maines tripped over a prominent divide in American life, one that became apparent in the run-up to the current war on Iraq. Some of us look up to the Europeans as the living embodiment of a higher civilization. And some of us look down on them as relics of a fading civilization.

I've always been bemused at the cultural divide not only between Red Country and Blue Country, but the one between the seemingly related musical genres of folk and country. I'm not that much of a country fan, but I've been a devotee of folk music since the sixties. I increasingly find that as such, I have to not only overlook some massively stupid political opinions of people whom I otherwise consider talented and pleasant to listen to, but to rein in my own political opinions when attending concerts. I can be almost certain that as, well, for lack of a better label, a hawkish libertarian, I'm in enemy territory, politically at such venues. It's almost as bad as attending a Unitarian service.

I suspect that the political gap between the folk music community, and the community of its C/W offspring, is attributable to the "urban folk" boom of the sixties, in which it became heavily associated with protest, and particularly socialist and leftist protest. Fortunately, despite that stereotype, there's a broad enough range of it, including instrumental, that I can still enjoy it, both on recorded media and live, just as long as I can hold my tongue.

Perhaps that's why the only folk musician I've ever been really fond of is Jimmie Driftwood. My grandpa used to play old radio recordings of his work. To this day, songs like 'Soldier's Joy' and the 'Battle of New Orleans' never fail to bring a smile to my face.

Rand,

I've been a folk music fan, on and off, for close to 40 years now. And I was a liberty loving leftist for a period back in the late 60s-early 70s. Isn't "liberty loving leftist" a contradiction in terms? Perhaps now it is. Then it wasn't -- although there were plenty of liberty hating leftists around.

Main drivers for folk protest 40 years ago were the potential for nuclear war (think Cuban missile crisis), real racism and some nasty corporate behavior. Democratic socialism was put forward as an antidote to problems. Independent people like me and Dale Amon saw the problems with socialism. We took different tacks than most of the folk music crowd in addressing these real problems.

Today I'm still friends with people on the left who share my democratic and libertarian values, even if I disagree with them on policy to some extent. Like I'm friendly with people on the right who share my fundamental worldview.

Rand, a few years back I bought on an impulse Peter, Paul and Mary's "A Holiday Celebration." It combines original material, some old standards, some Christian Christmas music, some Jewish music and a final rousing version of "Blowing in the Wind." Try listenting to it as a thoughtful libertarian. To me the clear bias is in favor of liberty and justice for all humans. If Saddam Hussein could appreciate the album, it would send chills down his spine. We're all arguing about the best way to put an end to tyranny -- not supporting tyranny over freedom.

I don't think there's anything wrong with the goals of many even in today's "peace" movement, Chuck. The problem is that they haven't been willing to think though the implications of their proposed means and stances, and that peace is much more than the simple absence of war.

"Imagine there's no hunger" is a nice thought, but simply imagining by itself rarely accomplishes anything in the material world, as no one knows better than those of us in the space movement.

The problem is that the people who "Imagine there's no hunger" never bother to imagine how we get there from here, as if wishful thinking is all it takes.

Hix nix dix chix

"Hix nix dix chix."

That's so last week. Give it up!

"Remember the folk music scare of the early '60s? Hey, that stuff almost caught on! -- Martin Mull

Agreed, Rand.

I've got real friends on both sides of the debate about this war. I encourage people to calm down (helpful for real thought) and think about what's happening and what actions to take. I remind people there's a huge difference between the Cuban missile crisis and the race to Baghdad. And an even bigger difference between the Russian Communists and Al Qaeda. The Communists had real power to destroy the world. The Islamofascists are a long way from that kind of power.

While the threat of the Soviets was different than that from Islamofascists, they do have a capability to destroy our world, though not in the literal material sense--but rather in the cultural and value sense--if we let them.

That's true, Rand.

But it's still a different sort of problem. I think we can beat, probably fairly easily, the latest kind of fascists. And without worrying about the deaths of millions. That's something to rejoice about.