In response to today's Fox News column (it's a reprise of this post from last night, with a new title), I got a couple emails from a Richard Lasher, who, judging by his email address, works for the government of the state of ten thousand lakes. Unfortunately, he's no Lileks:

I do not support ANY form of HUMAN space initiative. There is nothing we can "discover" that is worth just 1 human life! We should require a 500 year moratorium on space initiatives. The funds, resources, and energy should be devoted to solving REAL problems, here on Earth! If, after the 500 years, we are not extinct, do not live in caves, or only have pre-industrial age technology, then we should ask, "Are there any problems on Earth yet to solve?", and finding NONE, then consider space exploration.

Don't we have enough problems to solve? Drugs, Terrorists, HIV, SARS, children (American and worldwide) going to bed sick and hungry, an army (700,000 - 1 Million) of illegal aliens entering the U.S. every year, worldwide social issues of poverty, genocide, labor laws, environmental, and human rights issues need to be solved BEFORE "The World" should spend money on space exploration! To do otherwise is OBSCENE". What's the hurry? Our Sun won't destroy the Earth for several Billion years. Perhaps, if we survive for another million years we will have learned compassion (greed will no longer be a "GOD") and how to use the resources of the Earth to the benefit of ALL mankind, not just the rich, not just the multi-national corporations, not the warlords supported by drug money, or corrupt governments.

A few minutes later, thinking that the first one hadn't gone through, he sent another gem (he's apparently not familiar with the concept of a "sent" folder that allows one to resend emails). To wit (or in this case, lackwit):

I hope you got the text from my previous e-mail... It was really "good stuff" ;-}

My system prematurely sent the e-mail.

In Short. Stop human space initiatives, and focus on the real problems that we have here on Earth for the next 500 years and then see if space exploration should be a priority. What can we learn from human space travel that is worth just 1 human life? We can't go far enough to escape the Sun's destruction of the Earth is several billion years.

Who cares if the Earth is 13.57678765533445809987654345 Billion or Trillion years old? What can you do with than information? Who cares if the Universe was created by a "Big Bang" or a "Big Implosion", or the result of some "String thing"? What can you do with that information? Nothing! Who cares if Mars ever had water or Microbes? There is no surface water there now! Do we plan to import subterranean water from Mars, if there is any? NO!!!! So What, if there are live microbes on Mars? Who is to say that WE did not put them there by crashing into Mars on previous landing attempts? If there are microbe fossils, WHO CARES? That would say, "We are not alone in the Universe", if you equate human life to that of a microbe. It might be the same microbe that "got life started" on Earth, and even IF you could prove it, WHO CARES?

Space exploration is a shiny trinket, but we need to solve the tough problems here on Earth first!

"God help us" if we find anything of value on the Moon! We could have WW3 over that future resource!

It's a treasure trove of idiocy, complete with cranky idiosynchratic capitalization and lots of exclamation marks!! So we know it's really important, and must be true!!!!

It's not really worth fisking, and I'm busy today, but I thought I'd throw out some chum to the sharks in the comments section. I may get around to addressing it later if the mood strikes and I find some time.

[Update]

Here's another one, though not quite as bad, in an email with the subject "mars fantasy":

Every one is so positive about this new space program that was proposed by our president.

Balderdash! Are these people crazy? The war on terror is till continuing and will continue through our lifetime. Along with a huge national debt which is wrongly considered by neo-conservatives to be inconsequential. One accident in several years and we change everything around. Did anyone not think the space program to be dangerous? Loss of life was to be expected and will still happen in the new program.

The Mars mission had been proposed by Lyndon Larouche many years ago. It was to cost in the neighborhood of one trillion dollars. At the time his idea was ignored and he was considered to be a nut case. Isn't he now in jail?

The present approach is correct. The space shuttle is needed to put satellites in orbit, take them from orbit, and perform repairs. As well as for the construction of a space station; which will be necessary sooner or later. A prime example of the need for the space shuttle is the Hubble telescope which was a Major Triumph of the space program. Sadly I just learned that it has been admitted by these people that elimination of the space shuttle would mean that there would not be any more missions to the space telescope. And probably the enhanced space telescope would be canceled also. The news said that the telescope would degrade gradually and that this was very unfortunate. I call this ignorant; big time. Telescopes above the Earth's atmosphere are a part of the effort to explore space.

I have just read a book on the history of astronomy that was published in 1957. In that book it was mentioned that Dr. Werner Von Braun had a plan for going to the moon and Mars. It consisted of a space station at 1,000 miles above the Earth that would be used for the refueling, repair and construction of vehicles for traveling to the planets. He is said to consider that travel to the planets would be a simple task once the space station was in operation. Do we have anyone of the stature of Dr. Von Braun today or is every government agency staffed by party hacks that have not been educated in technical matters. Not to mention the numerous commissions.

I am ashamed of what the present administration has done. Are there no serious dissenters?

Gotta like a guy who uses the word "balderdash."

Even ignoring the mistaken notion that we can't walk and chew gum, or kill terrorists and explore the solar system at the same time, among the many other problems with this is, of course, the "poisoning the well" fallacy. Just because some reprehensible person advocates a position doesn't discredit the position. Hitler was militantly anti-smoking. I wonder if Michael thinks that therefore we should be even more firmly in favor of it?

I thought I'd throw out some chum to the sharks

[voice=Homer Simpson]

Mmm.... cranky!

[/voice]

;-)

This person probably still has his Wellstone yard signs up.

What, there weren't any LOL's or ROFL's in the text of the email? Since when do they let 11 year olds work in Minnesota State Government?

"God help us" if we find anything of value on the Moon! We could have WW3 over that future resource!

Yeah, that is, if and when anyone else manages to find a way to get there.

The mind boggles.

It never fails to amaze me how many people think that every dollar spent on NASA is a dollar that would otherwise have gone to some social entitlement or other. NASA, as dysfunctional as it is, has been far more cost-effective than (for example) HUD or Medicare.

Part of the problem is the US educational system. It's surely no coincidence that many "space is a waste" folks are also lousy at science. Many people manage to get a 4-year college degree without ever taking an advanced math or science course, which is just shameful.

On the other hand, if you read this guys emails as satire, they're pretty hilarious.... Iowahawk could hardly have done better!

I could only discuss the weather with such people - but it would be difficult to do so without the aid of space-based weather satellites.

If you consider the infinite monkeys paradigm, and its popular internet-related corollary, then this could even be called "pretty advanced"

I do not support ANY form of HUMAN WELFARE initiative. There is nothing we can "discover" that is worth just 1 human life! We should require a 500 year moratorium on WELFARE initiatives. The funds, resources, and energy should be devoted to solving REAL problems not on Earth! If, after the 500 years, we are not extinct, do not live in caves, or only have pre-industrial age technology, then we should ask, "Are there any problems on Earth yet to solve?", and finding SOME, then consider WELFARE exploration.

But all seriousness aside, this question was indeed asked 500 years ago (its asked every year), and by the standards of that time, we're ready to go!

He's just interested in his pork programs. All others are irrelevant in his mind. He would make a great Castro crony.

One of the assumptions behind the "No Space Travel Until We Fix Everything On Earth" position is the belief that humanity can actually fix everything, that we are progressing toward Utopia.

With exception (e.g., disease), most of our problems are our own doing and could be "fixed" if people just changed their behavior. No amount of money thown at these problems will "fix" all the problems of humanity, because humanity will simply create new problems.

The danger inherent in such thinking is the readiness of the True Believers to impose their assumptions and their behavior on others. This danger is inherent in anyone who acts out of ideology, either from the right or the left.

Sooner or later, one way or another, we will be a starfaring race. And we will take our squabbles and shortcomings with us to the stars.

The key mistake by this kind of idiot is that they assume that Earth is separate and unaffected from the rest of the Universe. In the last century, we have learned of a number of ways the Universe could kill us, and it is quite likely there are others we haven't learned yet. We are more likely to learn these things if we venture beyond this one tiny corner. On the other hand, new technologies and space resources could dramatically increase the wealth in local space (including earth). One thing is certain: Ignorance will kill us. If we don't pay attention to space, I think we'll be lucky to have civilization at all in 500 years.

It would be easy to dismiss these guys as just plain idiots, but there is something deeper going on here (well, perhaps not with this particular person.) I've had this same discussion regarding the 'waste of money' spent on space that could 'feed the poor' from several friends that I consider to be of more than average intelligence.

It's not a lack of intelligence or education that drives all people to these positions.

I've almost arrived at the conclusion that it's a horizon problem (like the chess program that makes stupid moves because it only looks a few moves ahead.) I try to be kind to people that don't understand my position. Frankly, some never will.

Appropriate response to your space-hayta letter-writers:

"Who cares what you think, you Yankee fag.?

Best,

B-chan

One of the assumptions behind the "No Space Travel Until We Fix Everything On Earth" position is the belief that humanity can actually fix everything, that we are progressing toward Utopia.

I'm more cynical than that. Given the guy is apparently a bureaucrat, it's actually his job to avoid solving problems, lest the reason for his job go away. From this point of view, NASA is a rival for funds and must be stopped -- STOPPED, I TELL YOU!!!!! -- so that money can be spent in his department perpetuating the problems it was created to "solve."

Ken, I certainly agree that the "solve every problem here on Earth" argument is a horizon problem; that's a good way of putting it. What's curious, however, is that argument only seems to come up with regards to space exploration; nobody seems to mention it with regards to, say, Hollywood or golf or freeway construction or excessive product packaging or -- industries which consume far more resources than space exploration likely ever will. So, why the fuss when space exploration comes up?

I think that there are two main problems: the first is that space exploration is one of the most visible and stirring ways to spend money, and hence one of the most noticeable. People tend to ignore that which doesn't grab the headlines. It never ceases to amaze me that people who think space exploration is terribly expensive or dangerous will carelessly drive the freeway to work, given that the interstate freeway system has cost well over a trillion dollars and somewhere around three million lives.

The second reason is more profound and paradoxical: people have "Horizon Problems" with space exploration, because space exploration lets them *see* the horizon. In normal everyday thinking, "here on Earth" is an overwhelmingly huge and amorphus context, which is taken for granted, and thus not given much thought. In the context of space exploration, however, the Earth becomes a discrete object among a larger context -- and thus worthy of analysis and concern for the whole. When people see the Earth as a whole, they are suddenly capable of having concerns they never had before, and this often results in either a fearful retreat from that view, or a slavish obsession with those concerns. It's worth remembering that image which, more than any other, launched the modern environmental movement, was taken during a lunar expidition.

I'm an environmentalist, and I generally consider attempting to solve problems here on Earth to be a good thing. However I also know that it is necessary to have a view from the high ground in order to even *think* of doing such things.

I'm also terribly over-employeed at the moment, and just realized that I'm late to work... :-) Good discussion, though!

It's a control problem. When all the dangerous people, who do dangerous things like thinking, inventing, or making, are locked up and completely controlled, then we can explore space. Of course, we won't "need" to by then.

Quote: "I do not support ANY form of HUMAN space initiative.....Don't we have enough problems to solve? Drugs."

Yes we need to solve the very serious problem of crank emailers doing all the drugs and not saving some for the rest of us.

Quote:"If, after the 500 years, we are not extinct, do not live in caves, or only have pre-industrial age technology, then we should ask, "Are there any problems on Earth yet to solve?"

Yes the magical tomorrow tommorrow land where all our problems will be solved and we will be thoroughly cleansed of our guilty selfish feelings about traveling into into space.