If this story is right, they have helped seal their doom by signing Kyoto:

At the peak of the last ice age, which began 70,000 years ago, 97% of Canada was covered by ice.

The research showed that without the human contribution to global warming, Baffin Island would today be in a condition of "incipient glaciation".

"Portions of Labrador and Hudson Bay would also have moved very close to such a state had greenhouse gas concentrations followed natural trends," said the scientists.

The experiment had probably underestimated the amount of ice that would exist today in north-east Canada without human interference, they said.

I don't know whether this is true or not, but particularly in light of the broken hockey stick, I find it just as plausible as the hysteria coming from the global warming types. And if it is right, apparently we aren't doing enough to stave off the return of the glaciers.

Time to go out and fire up the ol' SUV.

...I quit reading when they said, Computer Modeling.

My local weather guys use these models and tells me its going to rain 4 days from now and they are about 40% accurate. So how can I trust some model that says in 400 years my GGGGGG-grandchildren will be living in an ice box at the equator, if I don't kill all the SUV drivers.

BULL...loney

It is bloody cold in here. Could use with some global warming right now.

Personally, I consider the idea of reducing CO2 and CH4 emissions to be pure garbage. I have heard some environmentalists propose the equivalent of mandatory human and animal species cleansing to support their distorted world views. This nonsense must stop.

We do indeed have problems.

The fragile political situation in the Middle East plus the balooning oil demand from the growth of the Asian economies. India and China in particular.

We have problems with particulate emissions, proven to cause lung disease and linked to cardiovascular disease. Cardiovascular disease which, as you know, is the main death cause in the Western world today. We have problems with dioxins, NOx emissions, CO emissions, etc.

These emissions should be reduced to benefit the health of all of us.

I consider SUVs bad because they are a waste of oil and produce the before mentioned pollutants which are known leading causes of disease. But I suspect that once oil becomes scarce, the market will take care of removing SUVs from general use in 10 years, provided there is no governmental distortion that favours SUVs via subsidies.

I think the first warning sign should have been "we have no actual frickin' data for nearly all of this time." Because computer models are only dependable when applied to well-understood conditions, and these aren't.

"Our computer models, which are designed to model global warming, tell us that global warming is happening."

I'm expecting climate studies to continue to be an inexact science (to be absolutely charitable) for some time to come, because it will take another hundred years of measurements to begin to have a meaningful data set.

The real test of a computer model.

Work from say 1980 and see if you can accurately predict present conditions with the model and data at hand.

If it works, then wake me.

Typical circular reasoning arguments.

1. global warming is making the earth too hot.
2. Why isn't it any hotter?
3. The ice age returning is offsetting it.
4. Q.E.D. Global warming.

You guys are way behind the learning curve. Global dimming has been significantly offsetting global warming- and things have *not* been getting colder.

Climate scientists were worried before. They're closer to terrified now- there's actually a real chance of *runaway* global warming.

I've been sitting on the fence for ages; I've made up my mind- this is every bit as real as the ozone hole. There is *no* reason to think that pushing up the CO2 levels as we have been doing is not going to push up global temperatures; exactly the opposite.

The only glimmer of fresh hope I see is that global dimming offers a way to control the climate to a degree.

Fire up the SUV if you want Rand- then drive it right to the crushing plant.

"You guys are way behind the learning curve. Global dimming has been significantly offsetting global warming- and things have *not* been getting colder."

Thank God. Global cooling would be much worse than global warming.

"There is *no* reason to think that pushing up the CO2 levels as we have been doing is not going to push up global temperatures; exactly the opposite."

Well, except for that global dimming thing. I don't know about you, but I like Fallen Angels much better as fiction.

As soon as global dimming turns around, how about we all get behind a large-scale conversion to nuclear power. In either event, I'd rather have global warming than have everyone but the elite go back to horses and buggies, or even back to 1950's energy use.