Well, OK, psychopathic teenagers:

Washington and Brussels cut what is estimated to be hundreds of millions of dollars in direct aid to the Palestinian government after Hamas' parliamentary victory.

Both have said they will not resume monetary support of the Palestinian government until Hamas recognizes Israel, renounces violence and fulfills past promises.

Mashaal demanded in tougher terms that Washington resume its aid funding: "The American administration's insistence on the continuation of the blockade will give birth to more hatred toward America not only ... on a Palestinian level but on an Arab, Islamic level."

Right. "Give us money, or we'll hate you."

I don't mind it so much that, in their permanent adolescent angst, they're suicidal. I just wish that they wouldn't take innocents with them when they do it.

"The American administration's insistence on the continuation of the blockade will give birth to more hatred toward America..."

Memo to Mashaal: Cutting off your allowance does not constitute a blockade, numbnuts. Mind your manners, you'll get Pampers money for your larvae, it's as simple as that.

"... not only ... on a Palestinian level but on an Arab, Islamic level."

Hate away, boy, you'll do wonders.

Anywhere from 1.2 to 1.3 billion people on this planet are adherents of a religion whose prime figure of veneration put helpless prisoners to death, passed out their widows and orphans to be used as slaves by his followers, and married a nine-year old girl child. Speaking for myself, I find something to hate in that.

Maybe they could hold their breath until they're blue.

What I don't understand is why the people allow either of these to "represent" them. It's as if we allowed mob families to run on our ballots. I'm starting to believe that every Palestinian with any sense has already left. Those kids who are left have nothing to hope for except martyrdom.

I'm sixty-five, I've been paying attention, and I cannot remember a time when the Arab world wasn't busy hating us and spewing spittle in the direction of the Great Satan. This seemed to be true whoever was in charge, and whatever policy was being pursued.

If giving them money won't change their behavior, why give them money? It's Danegeld, I say, and to Hell with it.

Sounds like somebody needs a timeout...

It is always a temptation to an armed and agile nation,
To call upon a neighbour and to say:—
“We invaded you last night—we are quite prepared to fight,
Unless you pay us cash to go away.”

And that is called asking for Dane-geld,
And the people who ask it explain
That you’ve only to pay ’em the Dane-geld
And then you’ll get rid of the Dane!

It is always a temptation to a rich and lazy nation,
To puff and look important and to say:—
“Though we know we should defeat you, we have not the time to meet you.
We will therefore pay you cash to go away.”

And that is called paying the Dane-geld;
But we’ve proved it again and again,
That if once you have paid him the Dane-geld
You never get rid of the Dane.

It is wrong to put temptation in the path of any nation,
For fear they should succumb and go astray,
So when you are requested to pay up or be molested,
You will find it better policy to say:—

“We never pay any-one Dane-geld,
No matter how trifling the cost;
For the end of that game is oppression and shame,
And the nation that plays it is lost!"

Rudyard Kipling
"The Tax of the Danegeld"

Better watch yourself Mike, I don't think you got the memo from Dinesh D'Souza that in fact this is all the result of American movies and music and such, Islam is blameless, and we are simply failing to understand. I'm guessing ponying up more money to Hamas will help our understanding.

AST asks why the Palestinians allow these people to represent them. Here's a theory: they want them to. Opinion polls in this context are dodgy, but there seems no reason to think that many Palestinians have an other than tactical reason to oppose terrorism and Jew-killing.

Over the weekend I was talking to a friend who's an MD (rural GP) and "borderline personality disorder" came up. She was cataloging the symptoms, such as obsession that everything must be about ME, and yet nothing I attempt ever works, and it's because everyone conspires against ME -- and I realized that, point for point, it matched modern Arabic culture. Call it "Borderline Political Disorder."

"It's as if we allowed mob families to run on our ballots"
This made me laugh. In the election last year in Illinois we elected several people with ties to the mob, most notably our new state Treasurer the "banker for the mob", just because they said they hate Bush and are against the war. Because the state treasurer has so much influence on foreign policy, we'd rather have one that gives loans to the mob than someone who actually has experience and integrity but isn't against the war. But you know Illinois has always had corruption problems.

we shouldn't be payingthe palestinians,

we shouldn't be payingthe israeli's either.

Let them all learn to live on their own

The arab islamic world has been a problem for the United States for 200 years. Bribes have failed. Fighting back works. Search for the phrase "to the shores of Tripoli" to see how little has changed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Barbary_War

Anyone think that it would have helped a tiny bit if we told the Palestinians PRIOR to the elections that all aid would be cut off if they elected Hamas? Or did we set them up?

Anyone think that it would have helped a tiny bit if we told the Palestinians PRIOR to the elections that all aid would be cut off if they elected Hamas?

Oh, please.

(a) Do you really think they were that clueless?

(b) How would we tell them? How do we tell them anything? Only through Al Jazeera and other Palestinian outlets...

I'm perfectly willing to believe in massive incompetence on the part of the administration (not because it's "Bush," but because it's a stupid government bureaucracy) but if they don't get it by now, it's not our fault.

If we had told them before the election that we'd cut their aid if Hamas was elected, it would have been widely denounced as an unwarranted (and probably imperialist) attempt to interfere with the internal politics of a sovereign nation.

If we had told them before the election that we'd cut their aid if Hamas was elected, it would have been widely denounced as an unwarranted (and probably imperialist) attempt to interfere with the internal politics of a sovereign nation.

Yes, that too...

AST makes an important, and underrecognized point:

I'm starting to believe that every Palestinian with any sense has already left. Those kids who are left have nothing to hope for except martyrdom.

This is true. In the past sixty years there has been a substantial migration of "Palestinians" (meaning the Arabs within the declared borders of Israel in 1948). As time has gone by, and it's become apparent no viable state will ever emerge, the best and brightest have steadily left. You'll find plenty of sensible, accomplished, wealthy Palestinians -- in the UAE, in Dubai, in Saudia Arabia, in Europe and in the United States. You just won't find them in the refuse -- oops, I mean refugee -- camps that constitute the Palestinian "state" anymore.

There is no hope for the Palestinian state any more. Those who could form its leadership have long ago left. All that's left is the worst, the lowest intelligence, most emotionally unstable, the people who couldn't hold down a job roughnecking in an oil field in Kuwait even when the alternative is starving.

Might I suggest we start our new policy of appeasement with a hefty shipment of military aid ...

We get some important benefits form the military aid we give the Israelis. Among these are the refinement of American weapons systems by combat trials with Zahal. Another benefit is intelligence information. It should be plain as a pikestaff by now that the CIA is seriously dysfunctional. Our intel about the Middle East comes primarily from Israel and "national technical means" like communications intercepts. Then some malevolent twit or Saudi mole blows the cover of the terrorist cell-phone intercept program and we're back to depending on the Israelis again even for COMINT.

As for cutting off the money to the Palis, we don't owe them anything. What we gave them was largesse. What we got back from them was abuse and terrorism going back decades. If the US and Europe kept them cut off from the welfare payments that have kept them afloat these past five decades the Palis would have to work or starve. Their "Arab Brothers" or the Iranians might promise them money for terrorism, but they are better at promises than at forking over cold cash. Keep the Palis cut off, it's the best chance to actually bring about any peace there.

we shouldn't be paying the israeli's either.

Let them all learn to live on their own

Right, Anonymous Moron. After all, it worked out great with the Jews and the Germans, after all...

Rand, yes, I think they are pretty clueless. I do believe Carl has described aspects of their condition fairly well. You can't accept logical behavior from a society that has become that dysfunctional over such a long time. What I find hard to grasp is the lack of any sympathy for their condition. It is quite pitiful, and the blame for that is too complicated to be simplified as "all theirs." You either see the whole picture over time from the 40's or you don't. The election we essentially gave them was a gamble and they lost. I don't think we intended them to lose, but we had no plan B.

As for "wheels" assertion, I gues he/she doesn't realize that we were pushing an election on them, so forget all that "sovereign nation stuff." Forcing democracy from without can have strange results. Especially when our intel appears to be so crappy that anyone can hype a theory of their own and get away with it.

Do we need to fix their problem? Well maybe we don't, but then again it may be why when the Iraqis refer to our troops in B'dad they call them the Jews. It's all connected, and very messy, which is again why we should develop alternate energy sources and get the hell out of there.

Rand

What constitutional obligation does the US Taxpayer have
for Israel?

Ok, There was a holocaust, does that mean, the
American Constitution now specifies we should be
paying Israel forever?

Anon,

I'll bite. We should also quit subsidizing Germany, Britan, Belgium, Itaty with occupying forces and remove our bases. With the budgetary savings, we could subsidze Israel to our liking and get out of Europe like the Euros want.

Eh, just hire the entire nation of Israel as our mercenary army. They won't be hated any less, it probably won't cost us as much as fielding our own men, combining IDF spirit with American equipment will scare the pee out of our enemies, and the Angry Left will subside into silence 'cause they don't care how many Jews die.

Simberg

What constitutional obligation does the US have to Israel?

Anonymous Moron, no one has claimed that the US has a constitutional obligation to Israel, so I don't understand why you keep asking this stupid question.

Oh, wait--I do. You're a moron.

Simberg
So why do you have a problem with the US cutting off
payments to Israel?

if it's not a constitutional obligation, why should
Tax money get spent there?

Raising some bizarre comment about the jews and the germans
doesn't fully explain it.

"So why do you have a problem with the US cutting off payments to Israel? [I]f it's not a constitutional obligation, why should
Tax money get spent there?"

Two reasons: first, their political organization and philosophical beliefs are both compatible with and similar to ours; second, they're good at killing terrorists.