In the wake of the shootings, our friends across the Pond once again proudly put their ignorance on display:

"I think the reason it happens in America is there's access to weapons -- you can go into a supermarket and get powerful automatic weapons," Keith Ashcroft, a psychologist, told the Press Association.

You can't legally purchase "automatic" weapons anywhere, let alone in a supermarket, but that doesn't prevent Dr. Ashcroft from pontificating about a country he knows nothing about. And the WaPo reporter can't be bothered (and likely is just as clueless) to correct it for the reader.

Must be talking about the buildings that used to be supermarkets, and are now closed and turned into flea markets or expo centers used for gun shows where, in theory, you can buy a pre-ban weapon that can be converted into an automatic.

Or at least, that's the rationalisation he'd probably use to cover himself if anyone actually called him out on it.

Just a technical point - you can legally buy, own, and operate a full-auto weapon in the US, if you happen to live in a state that's OK with it, and if you're ready to pay the high price (no new manufacture or import allowed since 1986, so supply is tight) and do the federal paperwork - lots of forms culminating in an actual suitable-for-framing engraved tax stamp.

Far more relevant to the Virginia Tech shootings, though, is that campus being by law a "gun-free zone", AKA a guaranteed defenseless-victim zone, unlike most of the rest of the state. The students should sue.

Well, technically, you can get "powerful" *semi*automatic weapons at a Walmart. And some of them might even look scary.

That said, what's the home invasion rate across the pond these days? And how many people are being knifed or clubbed (or shot) to death by robbers?

Same ol same ol. When California was on the verge of the military style rifle ban, at least one local news station showed "demonstrations" of the weapons using fully automatic fire. Of course, you couldn't buy a fully automatic version, but they did assure that a few million clueless soccer moms would be in favor of the ban.

And how many people are being knifed or clubbed (or shot) to death by robbers?

Let me tell you, the murder rate in the United Kingdom is skyrocketing, not only because the innocent are defenseless, but also because it has a large, angry Muslim population. Why, in 2004 its homicide rate was 5 per million, which is almost one tenth of the homicide rate in the United States. That's pretty high.

Sorry, my first reference on homicide in the UK is not reliable. It's even worse than I feared. The homicide rate in England and Wales in 2005-2006 was 1.4 million per person per year. That's fully one fourth of what it is in the US. That's very high!

http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/crimeew0506.html
http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/05cius/offenses/violent_crime/murder_homicide.html

Argh, that should be 14 per million, garbled stats there.

let alone in a supermarket,

Not that that wouldn't be cool. I can see inexpensive 'house-brand' weapons and ammunition ...

There used to be "house brand" guns,such as the Western Field sold by Montgomery Ward (several different manufacturers) & the Ted Williams line sold by Sears.
I have a Sears Model 54,which is really a Winchester 94 with a slightly different forend & of course the name on the barrel.

Well non name, ours is stable to slightly declining and your is skyrocketing. Kepp it up and you will catch us soon.

People from other countries who like to blame our high murder rate on firearms ignore our non-firearms murder rate, which is around 1/3 of all murders is still higher then their total murder rates. Perhaps it isn't the guns, perhpas is is a failed WoD....

If we were serious aobut halving the US Homicide rate, we would cut and run from the WoD.

I was thinking this morning that this guy probably would have been less effective with an automatic weapon. If he fired auto, most of his rounds probably would have gone high, and he would have spent his ammunition faster. In addition, someone probably would have noticed a person toting around a large scary assault rifle.

Good point Leland. I was on an air base in Spain in the eighties. A spouse of a military member drove on base without stopping and a Spanish guard opened fire. He put 80 percent of his ammo in the ground and missed with the rest.

> that doesn't prevent Dr. Ashcroft from pontificating about a
> country he knows nothing about

Do you mean the United States or Great Britain?

The historically low murder rate in Britain precedes British gun control, so it can hardly be the result of gun control as Ashcroft says.

There was one case in the early 20th Century when London's unarmed "bobbies" were chasing some armed bank robbers. The policemen stopped and borrowed guns from people on the street as well as recruiting some armed civilian deputies. So, gun ownership and personal carriage were obviously very common at the time.

Of course you can get guns at some supermarkets. What about H & Krogers or Ralph's & Wesson?

If there were as many guns in America as this Brit thinks, none of the kids would be dead after the first two. The remaining American gun owners would have lit this murdering clown up, right there in the dorm hallway.

Yahoo! I'm heading out for the Kroger right now! I'm out of beer and I might as well pick up an automatic weapon while I'm at it!

So, gun ownership and personal carriage were obviously very common at the time.

Its an oft quoted story, likely they were service weapons IIRC the story was post-WW1.

There have been some "blips" in the UK homocide rate, especially with all of Harold Shipmans victims being counted in one year and putting another 20% on the tally for the entire country.

On the whole, the homocide rate is extremely low.

Another interesting statistic to look for is the number of police officers killed in the line of duty a year.

Just to make it easier.

http://www.policememorial.org.uk/Special_Rolls/Homicides/Homicide_List_1900.htm

But checking the data. I'm looking at the reported murder rates here:
http://www.murderuk.com/misc_crime_stats.html

Which could be said to be pretty stable, if not falling, even if you include the 54 victims of the July bombings in 2005. That's about 1.2 per 100,000 of population.

According to the site referenced above the US rate is around 5 per 100,000 - which is down on the historical number (using CIA and Nationmaster) of around 7 per 100K.

So, the homcide rate in the US is around a quarter of the UK rate, which is down from where it used to be.

So, the homcide rate in the US is around a quarter of the UK rate, which is down from where it used to be.

WHAT?

Hmm, if the presence of large numbers of guns per capita so obviously causes -- or is even clearly linked with -- slaughters like VT's, I wonder why we don't read headlines like these?

15 Dead In Rampage at Military Base

4 Shot Dead At College Shooting Match

5 More Murders At Local Rifle Range

First Day of Deer Season Brings Typical Crop of Multiple Homicides

Study: States With High Gun Ownership Have Twice The Average National Murder Rate

Can't remember seeing these headlines. Must be the VRWC, I guess.

D'oh, sorry, reverse that.

Well, I usually think of the war in Iraq as an unmitigated disaster. But I see that Iraqis do have one freedom that goes way beyond even what Americans have: They have the right to keep and bear arms in spades. You can't sue Baghdad University for any rule against bringing guns to school. If they have such a rule, they certainly don't enforce it. Concealed carry, open carry, semiautomatic, fully automatic, you name it. You can probably even tote an RPG.

Well, I usually think of the war in Iraq as an unmitigated disaster. But I see that Iraqis do have one freedom that goes way beyond even what Americans have: They have the right to keep and bear arms in spades. You can't sue Baghdad University for any rule against bringing guns to school. If they have such a rule, they certainly don't enforce it. Concealed carry, open carry, semiautomatic, fully automatic, you name it. You can probably even tote an RPG.

Another example of how anonymous posters bring down the quality of debate on this blog. None of what is written is true, so is this suppose to be sarcasm? If it is suppose to be sarcasm, what's it point?

Nonsense, Leland. They're our gullible straight men. Fools who volunteer to be the butt of cruel wit. Like so:

Well, I usually think of the war in Iraq as an unmitigated disaster....[more droning clueless cliched pap]...

Ah, a novel use of the word "think." Interesting. If only there was some TV show where amateur "thinkers" competed, the way amateur singers do on "American Idol". You'd be natural for one of the first-round contestants who provide comic relief and let the rest of us bask in the obvious superiority of our own talents.