Don’t tell me, Rand, that you think that today’s Baltic weather says anything about whether we’re experiencing man-made climate change.
Actually, I’m quite confident that some warm monger will claim that it’s proof of it. It’s a very robust theory. There is no evidence that is not evidence for it.
As seen here, ice coverage in the Baltic varies widely by year.
I’m always amused at the inability of leftists to take a joke.
In any case, an unfalsifiable hypothesis is dogma, not science.
I wonder how much ice there was during the MWP? Thoughts, Jim?
Ah, Manbearpig, we hardly knew ye!
Bill,
MWP only happened because 12th century industrialists poured massive amounts of CO2 into the atmosphere to power their evil factories.
Yes, Rand, it’s just unbelievable that you’d take something like the weather and relate it in any way whatsoever to climate.
“Today’s” Baltic weather? If enough sea ice appeared in one day to trap 50 ships, we have a climate problem all right — but it has nothing to do with warming.
Rand – your joke might have been funnier if I hadn’t watched Fox News spend the last month arguing that a blizzard in DC meant global warming was over. It’s part of the “heads I win tales you lose” accounting we seem to play with climate and weather. Like for example your shocking silence about the need to fly snow in to Vancouver for the Olympics.
Bill Maron – if you click on my previous link, you’ll see that there were relatively ice-free years during the Little Ice Age, so I’d imagine that there were ice-covered years during the MWP.
MfK – the Baltic, or at least the northern part of it, freezes over most years. The reason ships are trapped is that the wind has created ice ridges. If it was just sheet ice, they’d push on through.
“Like for example your shocking silence about the need to fly snow in to Vancouver for the Olympics.”
The weather in Vancouver is much like that of Seattle. Snowfall is quite rare at this time of year there. Canada’s a big country. I’m surprised they picked a part of it with such a mild climate to have the Winter Olympics. It’s almost as if the powers that be don’t believe their own claims of global warming.
Rand – your joke might have been funnier if I hadn’t watched Fox News spend the last month arguing that a blizzard in DC meant global warming was over.
On what planet did that occur?
It’s part of the “heads I win tales you lose” accounting we seem to play with climate and weather.
That’s a joke, right?
That’s a joke, right?
No, that’s part of YOUR joke. Al Gore is on a ship on the frozen Baltic staring in disbelief at the ice all around him…and therefore global warming is a hoax. That’s the gist of the argument, right? But of course global climate change doesn’t predict crap about the local weather change in any given part of the world. If it did, you would have to agree that an unseasonably warm spell in some corner of the earth means that the earth is warming, too. Right?
Al Gore’s claims are not representative of the theory of anthropomorphic global warming. His predictions are more immediate and alarmist than any of the legitimate scientific theories. As such, it seems perfectly reasonable to point and laugh at him when reality disagrees.
Snowfall is quite rare at this time of year there.
You have no idea what you’re talking about. I lived in North Vancouver, quite recently, and snowfall was very common. But even if that weren’t true, it doesn’t say jack about the truth of global warming. Local instances DO NOT MATTER — global trends do.
Al Gore’s claims are not representative of the theory of anthropomorphic global warming. His predictions are more immediate and alarmist than any of the legitimate scientific theories.
Back this up with anything at all from a “legitimate scientific theory” that doesn’t include Anthony Watts or Fox News.
Oh no Dave, you back it up.. if you think there’s any legitimate scientific paper which says the ice caps are going to melt, disrupt the North Atlantic current and cause a new ice age, all within our lifetimes, please, do present it. Oh, and The Day After Tomorrow just doesn’t count.
Well said, Trent. I might add that Dave should also ignore any “peer reviewed” studies that limited their tree ring analysis to only three trees.
No, that’s part of YOUR joke. Al Gore is on a ship on the frozen Baltic staring in disbelief at the ice all around him…and therefore global warming is a hoax. That’s the gist of the argument, right? But of course global climate change doesn’t predict crap about the local weather change in any given part of the world. If it did, you would have to agree that an unseasonably warm spell in some corner of the earth means that the earth is warming, too. Right?
We’ve been hearing those claims for year. Every summer heat wave it touted as proof of global warming. Then, every winter storm is also touted as proof of global warming. We’ve even heard some morons claiming earthquakes are proof of global warming. Only now, they want to change it to “climate change” to cover their bases whether things warm or cool. Very convenient, eh?
AGW is a hypothesis based on the claim that the climate is warming and human activity is the cause. The burden of proof for any hypothesis is on the ones making the claim. That’s the standard of science, not the other way around. Given the questionable state of the climate studies and databases, it’s going to be hard to prove AGW exists.
“Back this up with anything at all from a “legitimate scientific theory” that doesn’t include Anthony Watts or Fox News.”
As long as you don’t use anything from the IPCC.
Thanks for making my point, Chris.
Like for example your shocking silence about the need to fly snow in to Vancouver for the Olympics.
Snowfall is quite rare at this time of year there.
You have no idea what you’re talking about. I lived in North Vancouver, quite recently, and snowfall was very common.
If you’ll notice I said that snowfall is quite rare at this time of the year. Its climate is designated as “mild.” I didn’t say it never snowed, or that temperatures should be in the 70s in January. And I am sure it snows a bit every year. But to go into hysterics because there was not the sort of snow that people expect for the Winter Olympics in a city where there is rarely that sort of snow is ridiculous.
And yes, local instances don’t matter (you know, like Vancouver having a warmer-than-usual winter — Vancouver is just a local place, right?), but this year on a lot of the globe it’s been colder than average. How much of the Earth has to have a colder-than-normal winter before you give up your global warming fantasy?
Al Gore is on a ship on the frozen Baltic staring in disbelief at the ice all around him…and therefore global warming is a hoax. That’s the gist of the argument, right?
No. I didn’t make an argument. I made a joke. It’s a running one with Al Gore, who is also a running joke.
Ah Gerrib, he of ancedotal is scientific proof, “warmest January in the 32 year satellite data base”. But let’s dig into that:
This record warmth will seem strange to those who have experienced an unusually cold winter. While I have not checked into this, my first guess is that the atmospheric general circulation this winter has become unusually land-locked, allowing cold air masses to intensify over the major Northern Hemispheric land masses more than usual.
What’s that again?
cold air masses to intensify over the major Northern Hemispheric land masses
You mean like the USA? Why isn’t the USA one of the worst offenders of anthropogenic global warming? It’s what Al Gore claims.
But alas, the temperature is getting colder on the landmass and warmer in the oceans. How can that be? And, oh snap, those 50 ships are not trapped in a land mass.
I guess I’m not amused.
Probably not Gerrib, but I for one am LMAO at your comments.
I guess I’m not amused.
Well, the capacity for amusement is associated with intelligence, so…
Chris L. Says:
March 4th, 2010 at 3:55 pm
In any case, an unfalsifiable hypothesis is dogma, not science.
So you do finally come out and admit that you agree with us that the ‘Man Made Global Warming’ hysteria is mainly religion with a scattering of facts.
Nice to see you finally woke up.
Tom,
I’ve been a skeptic on AGW for quite some time. My first indication that there was a problem is when they changed the name from global warming to climate change. It sounded like a way to blame just about every weather anomaly on human activity. That’s what I mean by unfalsifiable. No amount of counter data seems to mean that AGW is wrong because AGW can never be wrong.
Don’t tell me, Rand, that you think that today’s Baltic weather says anything about whether we’re experiencing man-made climate change.
Actually, I’m quite confident that some warm monger will claim that it’s proof of it. It’s a very robust theory. There is no evidence that is not evidence for it.
As seen here, ice coverage in the Baltic varies widely by year.
I’m always amused at the inability of leftists to take a joke.
In any case, an unfalsifiable hypothesis is dogma, not science.
I wonder how much ice there was during the MWP? Thoughts, Jim?
Ah, Manbearpig, we hardly knew ye!
Bill,
MWP only happened because 12th century industrialists poured massive amounts of CO2 into the atmosphere to power their evil factories.
Yes, Rand, it’s just unbelievable that you’d take something like the weather and relate it in any way whatsoever to climate.
“Today’s” Baltic weather? If enough sea ice appeared in one day to trap 50 ships, we have a climate problem all right — but it has nothing to do with warming.
Rand – your joke might have been funnier if I hadn’t watched Fox News spend the last month arguing that a blizzard in DC meant global warming was over. It’s part of the “heads I win tales you lose” accounting we seem to play with climate and weather. Like for example your shocking silence about the need to fly snow in to Vancouver for the Olympics.
Bill Maron – if you click on my previous link, you’ll see that there were relatively ice-free years during the Little Ice Age, so I’d imagine that there were ice-covered years during the MWP.
MfK – the Baltic, or at least the northern part of it, freezes over most years. The reason ships are trapped is that the wind has created ice ridges. If it was just sheet ice, they’d push on through.
Time Magazine: “Another Blizzard: What Happened to Global Warming?”
http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1962294,00.html
“Like for example your shocking silence about the need to fly snow in to Vancouver for the Olympics.”
The weather in Vancouver is much like that of Seattle. Snowfall is quite rare at this time of year there. Canada’s a big country. I’m surprised they picked a part of it with such a mild climate to have the Winter Olympics. It’s almost as if the powers that be don’t believe their own claims of global warming.
Rand – your joke might have been funnier if I hadn’t watched Fox News spend the last month arguing that a blizzard in DC meant global warming was over.
On what planet did that occur?
It’s part of the “heads I win tales you lose” accounting we seem to play with climate and weather.
That’s a joke, right?
That’s a joke, right?
No, that’s part of YOUR joke. Al Gore is on a ship on the frozen Baltic staring in disbelief at the ice all around him…and therefore global warming is a hoax. That’s the gist of the argument, right? But of course global climate change doesn’t predict crap about the local weather change in any given part of the world. If it did, you would have to agree that an unseasonably warm spell in some corner of the earth means that the earth is warming, too. Right?
Al Gore’s claims are not representative of the theory of anthropomorphic global warming. His predictions are more immediate and alarmist than any of the legitimate scientific theories. As such, it seems perfectly reasonable to point and laugh at him when reality disagrees.
Snowfall is quite rare at this time of year there.
You have no idea what you’re talking about. I lived in North Vancouver, quite recently, and snowfall was very common. But even if that weren’t true, it doesn’t say jack about the truth of global warming. Local instances DO NOT MATTER — global trends do.
Al Gore’s claims are not representative of the theory of anthropomorphic global warming. His predictions are more immediate and alarmist than any of the legitimate scientific theories.
Back this up with anything at all from a “legitimate scientific theory” that doesn’t include Anthony Watts or Fox News.
Oh no Dave, you back it up.. if you think there’s any legitimate scientific paper which says the ice caps are going to melt, disrupt the North Atlantic current and cause a new ice age, all within our lifetimes, please, do present it. Oh, and The Day After Tomorrow just doesn’t count.
Well said, Trent. I might add that Dave should also ignore any “peer reviewed” studies that limited their tree ring analysis to only three trees.
No, that’s part of YOUR joke. Al Gore is on a ship on the frozen Baltic staring in disbelief at the ice all around him…and therefore global warming is a hoax. That’s the gist of the argument, right? But of course global climate change doesn’t predict crap about the local weather change in any given part of the world. If it did, you would have to agree that an unseasonably warm spell in some corner of the earth means that the earth is warming, too. Right?
We’ve been hearing those claims for year. Every summer heat wave it touted as proof of global warming. Then, every winter storm is also touted as proof of global warming. We’ve even heard some morons claiming earthquakes are proof of global warming. Only now, they want to change it to “climate change” to cover their bases whether things warm or cool. Very convenient, eh?
AGW is a hypothesis based on the claim that the climate is warming and human activity is the cause. The burden of proof for any hypothesis is on the ones making the claim. That’s the standard of science, not the other way around. Given the questionable state of the climate studies and databases, it’s going to be hard to prove AGW exists.
“Back this up with anything at all from a “legitimate scientific theory” that doesn’t include Anthony Watts or Fox News.”
As long as you don’t use anything from the IPCC.
Thanks for making my point, Chris.
I know why that happened.
If you’ll notice I said that snowfall is quite rare at this time of the year. Its climate is designated as “mild.” I didn’t say it never snowed, or that temperatures should be in the 70s in January. And I am sure it snows a bit every year. But to go into hysterics because there was not the sort of snow that people expect for the Winter Olympics in a city where there is rarely that sort of snow is ridiculous.
And yes, local instances don’t matter (you know, like Vancouver having a warmer-than-usual winter — Vancouver is just a local place, right?), but this year on a lot of the globe it’s been colder than average. How much of the Earth has to have a colder-than-normal winter before you give up your global warming fantasy?
Al Gore is on a ship on the frozen Baltic staring in disbelief at the ice all around him…and therefore global warming is a hoax. That’s the gist of the argument, right?
No. I didn’t make an argument. I made a joke. It’s a running one with Al Gore, who is also a running joke.
Andrea Harris – This is the warmest January in the 32-year satellite-based data record.
Or, January 2010 in Vancouver warmest on record.
I guess I’m not amused.
Ah Gerrib, he of ancedotal is scientific proof, “warmest January in the 32 year satellite data base”. But let’s dig into that:
This record warmth will seem strange to those who have experienced an unusually cold winter. While I have not checked into this, my first guess is that the atmospheric general circulation this winter has become unusually land-locked, allowing cold air masses to intensify over the major Northern Hemispheric land masses more than usual.
What’s that again?
cold air masses to intensify over the major Northern Hemispheric land masses
You mean like the USA? Why isn’t the USA one of the worst offenders of anthropogenic global warming? It’s what Al Gore claims.
But alas, the temperature is getting colder on the landmass and warmer in the oceans. How can that be? And, oh snap, those 50 ships are not trapped in a land mass.
I guess I’m not amused.
Probably not Gerrib, but I for one am LMAO at your comments.
Well, the capacity for amusement is associated with intelligence, so…
Chris L. Says:
March 4th, 2010 at 3:55 pm
In any case, an unfalsifiable hypothesis is dogma, not science.
So you do finally come out and admit that you agree with us that the ‘Man Made Global Warming’ hysteria is mainly religion with a scattering of facts.
Nice to see you finally woke up.
Tom,
I’ve been a skeptic on AGW for quite some time. My first indication that there was a problem is when they changed the name from global warming to climate change. It sounded like a way to blame just about every weather anomaly on human activity. That’s what I mean by unfalsifiable. No amount of counter data seems to mean that AGW is wrong because AGW can never be wrong.